Tag: Wassail

WASSAIL! An Interview with Greg Spawton

On By bradbirzerIn progressive rock music6 Comments

An interview with Greg Spawton, August 28, 2015.

Greg Spawton needs no introduction to this audience. He is one of the founders of Big Big Train, its bass player, and, now, one of its two main songwriters and leaders in the band.  He is also, not surprisingly, a true renaissance man, interested in everything imaginable and not just large railroad cars!  He reads, he travels, he explores.  He’s also quite “normal.”  He’s a father as well as a husband.  He’s, frankly, an all-around great guy.

As most of you probably also know, the five original editors founded progarchy initially as an unofficial Big Big Train fan website.  Though we have grown to analyze all music, we will never forget our original purpose.  And, thank the good Lord that BBT continues to earn such love and admiration.

bbt (1)
The set (missing a few EPs).

*****

Progarchy: Greg, thanks so much for taking the time to talk with us.  It’s always a pleasure.  What was it like working in Peter Gabriel’s studio?  Did it feel like it was a once-in-a-lifetime experience?  Was it a learning experience, or was it really just recording in a large studio, bigger than your normal one?

Spawton: Real World is a unique environment: historic mill buildings converted to cutting-edge recording rooms and facilities set in a beautiful rural location. The studio is fully residential so you eat and sleep on site. The sound engineers are extremely talented and knowledgeable and all of the staff are friendly people who do all they can to make the time that musicians have on site productive and enjoyable. We have spent two weeks there now on two separate occasions and will be recording there again in November so it has become one of our main bases.

Progarchy: Since we last talked, Greg, you’ve added two new members to the BBT lineup?  Can you tell us a bit about each and what they’ve brought to the band?

Spawton: Rachel and Rikard have proven to be superb recruits to the band. Initially, they were brought in to help realise the songs in the live environment, with Rachel providing string parts and Rikard guitar and keyboard. However, both are intensely musical individuals and they have added a huge amount to our musical firepower. They are also both lovely people. At this stage in my life, I don’t want to waste any time working with people I don’t get on with, or who are not on our wavelength. The fit with Rachel and Rikard is perfect.

Add Rachel and Rickard (and Rob Aubrey) and you have BBT.
Add Rachel and Rickard (and Rob Aubrey) and you have BBT.

Progarchy: Nice.  Can you give us a run down on upcoming BBT projects—any details about content and release dates?

Spawton: There are quite a few things in the pipeline. First to be released should be STONE AND STEEL which will be a DVD / Blu-Ray featuring in-studio live performances from 2014 plus some documentary footage of the band evolving from the studio to the stage. We also hope to include some footage from our recent gigs. The aim is for a November release.

We have a new album which we are working on at the moment. This is called FOLKLORE and will feature up to an hour of new music. It will be released in early June 2016.

Alongside FOLKLORE, we are working on STATION MASTERS which is a three CD release which will serve as an overview of the band’s music up to FOLKLORE. All of the older songs featured (songs from before David became lead singer in 2009) will be re-recorded with the new line-up. This is planned for Spring 2017 and will be released at the time of our next live shows.

Progarchy: Phew.  Amazing.  Well, that’s a cornucopia for all Passengers!  About 2 years ago, in an interview with PROGRESSION [no. 65] magazine, you’d mentioned BBT would release a concept album.  Is this the same as FOLKLORE?  Or, was that a different project altogether?

Spawton: It is a separate release which will be a double concept album. Much of the music is written for this and some of it has already been recorded. However, it is a big project and we knew we wouldn’t get it finished in the next year, so we decided to write a separate set of songs for FOLKLORE as we wanted to release an album in 2016. We aim to have the double album out in 2017 or 2018.

The Green Man sees all.
The Green Man sees all.

Progarchy: One of the things that so permeates WASSAIL—all four songs—is the deep layering of mythologies and symbols.  From the Judeo-Christian to the Anglo-Saxon mythology of apples, for example, on WASSAIL.  Do you intentionally set out to do this, or does this come naturally to BBT?

Spawton: It just happens, really. Themes emerge through conversation between me and David or through our own research. We are both quite ‘bookish’ when it comes to writing lyrics. We like to write about something.

Progarchy: A follow up to the previous question.  Where do you see yourself in the current music scene?  Would you label yourselves as anything in particular or just as prog rock or rock, broadly defined?  A recent issue of PROG, of course, called you folk-prog.

Spawton: They can call us what they like as long as they are listening. We are always very happy to be defined as a prog rock band. Progressive music draws from so many different sources and enables bands to cover so much musical territory. We don’t find the label, or the genre itself, restrictive in any way. A lot of people call us pastoral and there is certainly a folk influence in some of what we do, but we listen and absorb influences from many different types of music. Anything we enjoy, really.

Progarchy: Again, another follow-up, if you don’t mind.  It’s possible that the most powerful moment in all of your music is the reading by John Betjeman and the honor you give it and him.  Would you do something like this again, and, if so, with what figure(s)?

Spawton: The inclusion of Betjeman’s voice was suggested by Andy Tillison [The Tangent, as almost every one of you knows—ed.]. When I heard it I just thought: ‘of course.’ Subsequently, I have been in touch with the historian Michael Wood and we have discussed using his voice in a spoken word moment. Michael Wood is a very well known English historian and has been a big influence on me. I would like to feature his voice at some stage.

Progarchy: A lot has happened to you this past month.  What were your impressions of offering the three shows in London?  In personal correspondence many years back now, you’d mentioned to me that you thought the last time you toured, it was a bit unpleasant.  My word, not yours, Greg.  But, I think I’m close in describing what you wrote to me.  Were these three August shows redemption?

Rust never sleeps. It remains alive in song.
Rust never sleeps. It remains alive in song.

Spawton: The last gig played by Big Big Train prior to the shows this year was back in the late 1990’s and didn’t go well. It was at a festival in the Netherlands and we faced lots of technical problems. Our music didn’t fit the festival very well either, so it wasn’t a good experience. However, I don’t connect that in any way to our recent live experiences. Different era, different line-up. If there is any sense of redemption it is more in the overall trajectory of the band. We have turned things around in the last few years. Some of that is through sheer bloody-mindedness, mostly it is because we now have the right line-up for the band’s songs which has taken the music to another level.

Progarchy: During the tour, what moments worked best?  Were there any moments in which you thought, “Ok, this is exactly why we wrote or recorded this.”  When I lecture, for example, things I’ve always believed become somehow more real or tangible as I state them and place those ideas between me and my students.  Did something similar happen with playing the music for you in London?

Spawton: Yes, I know exactly what you mean. There were many moments like that, where things felt fully realised. A few things spring to mind, for example the early instrumental sections in THE UNDERFALL YARD where things really groove now and it takes on a sort of fusion feel and WASSAIL, which is such a fun song to play as an ensemble. One particular bit at one of the gigs sticks in my mind, which was during the faster section in “East Coast Racer” starting with the electric piano solo and ending with the ‘she flies’ moment. I remember looking up at the screen which was showing some film footage and then looking up at the brass band who were in full flow and then seeing a guy in the balcony standing up and extending his arms out as if they were wings and I thought ‘we’re really flying here.’

Progarchy: A personal question, Greg, if you don’t mind.  Chris Squire (RIP) just passed away.  As a bass player, was he much of an influence on you?

Spawton: Chris Squire developed a particular way of playing which gave him a strong signature. Sometimes, when I become aware that I may be straying onto his territory, I step back. His was an exceptional talent and it is hard to believe he won’t be seen on a stage again.

Progarchy: Beautifully put.  And, a fine tribute.  On another topic, you’re an avid reader.  What are you reading now?  History?  Fiction?  Anything you’ve read recently that really struck you as meaningful?

Spawton: Mainly history at the moment.  I have been reading a few books about the dawn of civilisation in recent weeks, back to the Sumerians. Ancient Worlds by Richard Miles is very good. I am trying to follow things through from there and get a good broad grasp of the timelines. Right now I am reading a book by Tom Holland on the Persian / Greek conflict, the original clash between East and West. In the next week or so I need to start some research into the stories I am writing about on FOLKLORE, so there will be some different books coming down from the shelves.

Progarchy: What music are you listening to at the moment?

Spawton: Elbow released a nice EP a couple of weeks ago. And I am still listening to the recent Mew album. The best new thing I have heard recently was by Sweet Billy Pilgrim. I suspect I will be getting all of their albums. I do have some cool gigs coming up. I am seeing King Crimson with David. I also have tickets for PFM, The Unthanks and an acoustic show by Mew.

Progarchy: Thank you so much, Greg.  Not to embarrass you too much, but every progarchist is a huge fan of your work.  We’re proud not only to know you, but to see the excellence you continue to pursue.  Congratulations on all of your recent successes.  All well deserved.

BBT’s official website: http://www.bigbigtrain.com

Apotheosis of the Prog of Place: Big Big Train (a different kind of review)

On By Jay WatsonIn progressive rock music5 Comments

wassail

Music is powerful. C.S. Lewis wrote: “The books or the music in which we thought the beauty was located will betray us if we trust to them; it was not in them, it only came through them, and what came through them was longing. These things—the beauty, the memory of our own past—are good images of what we really desire; but if they are mistaken for the thing itself they turn into dumb idols, breaking the hearts of their worshippers. For they are not the thing itself; they are only the scent of a flower we have not found, the echo of a tune we have not heard, news from a country we have never yet visited.” [The Weight of Glory]

Music is transcendent and truly exists only among man (whales, wolves, and birds notwithstanding.) who use music to imitate and re-create the ontological, above and beyond the emotions of pain, loss, or even temporary contentment.

As much as I/we may like and enjoy rock and pop music (I do love the Ramones, Beach Boys, and Abba. to name but a few) the true worth of progressive rock music, “prog,” is that it not only frustrates the mere commercial designs of FM station managers and music directors (3-minute bites and bottom line revenues $) but that its subject matter soars above cars, girls, booze, and rebellion.

The greatest prog bands and performers have always opened the listener to challenging vistas of speculative fiction, socio-economic dynamics, and the very heart of man itself—sin and redemption; self-sacrifice and self-reflection; and grace. Whether it’s RUSH with 2112, DREAM THEATRE with Scenes from a Memory, or MARILLION’s Brave, the best of progressive lyrics and engaging musical composition, always enrich, and makes one more human than just about any other genre of current musical fare.

And as much as I love science fiction concept albums or cosmic themed instrumental tone-pieces, there is one theme that touches something very deep inside all of us—the stories of our homes, families, neighborhoods, towns and shires. The idea of place is both nominal and real. We all come from some place and we all want to go back to those special places of the heart—our past and our future—that bring reunion and safe haven.

There are some seminal bands that have addressed these topics of land and earth, i.e. PLACE, and its inextricable connection, at least hitherto, with the wandering and prodigal pilgrims of the age of impermanence. JETHRO TULL gave us the criminally underrated Heavy Horses (and other classics on most of their discography) and Ray Davies & The KINKS produced the greatest of the 1960s musical manifestos to agrarian worth and the encroachments of modernity for modernity’s sake with The Kinks Are The Village Preservation Society. Some of early GENESIS also taps into the vanishing pastoral Britain (parts of Selling England & Wind and Wuthering might be examples). BARCLAY JAMES HARVEST also explored these themes in their 1970s and 80s recordings. John Lees specifically addresses his own background of growing up in Manchester in his 2013 album North.

It doesn’t matter whether one grew up in East London, Birmingham, Bournemouth, Glasgow (Al Stewart’s 45 year career is sprinkled with nods to not just his love for “general” history but to his own roots), Dublin (Horslips) or Topeka, Kansas (Kerry Livgren’s career with and without KANSAS bespeaks a loving and nostalgic nod to his home town and state).

All of the above is my way of saying that progressive music has found its penultimate, if not ultimate, purveyor of music of “place” with BIG BIG TRAIN.

I just listened to my copy of Wassail (which finally arrived from amazon.com) and in a heightened state of “enthused” tranquility wanted to pen a review that wasn’t a review. Nobody can say it any better than Brad Birzer did in his own superb review a few days ago right here ( https://progarchy.com/2015/06/05/a-good-little-truth-bbts-wassail/ ) but I wanted to share just WHY BBT touches so many of us.

   The best music, like the best literature, art, and food is not abstract, ethereal, and free-floating in the aether. BIG BIG TRAIN grounds their brilliant songs in their own mother Muse of England; not England of the silver-screen or modern television, but England of the docks, quarries, factories, row houses, back alleys, family tables, and gravesides. BIG BIG TRAIN is the soundtrack to contemplating the “higher things.” Though Wassail is only a four song ep it continues their passage through the seas of brilliance to the Grey Havens of musical Proghalla.

And as much as I love hearing Joey singing “Beat on the Brat,” BIG BIG TRAIN elevates us all in ways that Southern Agrarians, British dock workers, West Virginia coal miners, and families of faith not only understand, but believe in their souls. While BBT writes the truth that the hymnist penned in the words “change and decay in all around I see…” they also place us at the family table of peace and community.

A Good Little Truth: BBT’s Wassail

On By bradbirzerIn progressive rock music6 Comments

Big Big Train, Wassail (English Electric, 2015)

Tracks: Wassail; Lost Rivers of London; Mudlarks; and Master James of St. George.

BBT Wassail
Wassail, the new EP from Big Big Train

As far as I know, I’ve never tasted Wassail.

Of course, I come from Bavarian peasant stock and possess, sadly, not a drop of Anglo-Saxon or Celtic blood in my veins.  My wife, however, is blessed with Celtic as well as Swedish ancestry, and I’m more than happy to have played a role in passing those genes on to our rather large gaggle of children.

As far back as I remember, though, my very German-American family drank something that sounds quite similar, at least in essence if not in accidents, to Wassail, Gluhwein.  Even the very word Gluhwein conjures not just the scents of warm cinnamon, cloves, and anise, but also the idea of heavenly comfort and satiation.

Much the same could be said of all of Big Big Train’s music.  Not that it doesn’t have its share of tensions and darker moments within the music, but, it’s hard to imagine a band in the world today that better understands the goods and beauties of this world than does Big Big Train.  They find glory in even the most ordinary of things.  And, rightly so.

A beautifully rendered cover, layered with symbolism equal to the music in every way.
A beautifully rendered cover, layered with symbolism equal to the music in every way.

Wassail is a triumph, frankly.  Not a huge triumph in the way The Underfall Yard or English Electric were each immense, almost overwhelming, triumphs, but a triumph, nonetheless.

A good, little truth.

In Greek, one would employ a word that has become utterly perverted over the last hundred years to describe Wassail best: a “dogma.”  Literally, translating it from Greek to Latin, a dogma means a “good little thing,” a thing good in and of itself whether we understand its relation to larger truths or not.

Such is Wassail.  A good little truth, whether we understand its relation to anything else or not.  Only four songs at 25 minutes and 39 seconds, Wassail ends all too quickly.  And, yet, for those nearly 26 mintues it plays, it fills our souls to the brim.

The opening song, “Wassail,” is a sing-songy English folk tune, completely with poetic and thoughtful lyrics.  Here is the apple—the symbol of the devil, the instrument that caused the Fall, and the fruit that, to this day, brings so much love and joy.  How can one thing be so loaded down by so many meanings—from the very existence of the universe and our relation in it, to the very thing that serves at the heart of what our grandmothers make best?  This is a Longdon song, pure and simple.  It is, for all intents and purposes, the sequel to Hedgerow, but without the rock edge.

The second song, “Lost Rivers of London,” is as much a Greg Spawton-song as the first was a Longdon song.  What remains of the ancient world under the very streets of the city that represents so much good and truth in this world?  What has nature wrought, our ancestors cultivated, and our current generation forgotten?  These are quintessential Spawton questions, and, of course, true to Gregorian form, he serves as our modern natural historian, our urban archeologist, and our prog bard.

The third song, “Mudlarks,” is also a Spawton song, but its fullness comes across as a Big Big Train song more than the song of any one person.  On “Mudlarks,” every member of the band, contributes and plays his or her heart out.  Of the four songs, this is the most pop-rock oriented, despite the use of a whole set of rather folksy strings.

The final song of the EP, “Master James of St. George,” reveals just how much the band has evolved since the song first appeared—rather gloriously—on The Underfall Yard.  Recorded live at Peter Gabriel’s Real World Studios, this version of “Master James” is much more layered than the original.  Whereas the original offered a folksy minimalism, this version is layered almost beyond reason.  The new strings add much but what really comes to the fore in this version is Danny Manner’s keyboards.

Big Big Train in Real World Studios.
Big Big Train in Real World Studios.

The Wassail version of “Master James” in no way makes the original obsolete.  Quite the opposite.  This new version just makes those of us who love BBT justifiably a little prouder of them.  For, really, this version shows just how truly alive their music is, how much depth it possesses, and long it will be remembered. . . long after any of us have vanished from this world.

Let us just hope when we get there (wherever “there” is), we know which apple to choose.  It’s pretty clear that BBT wishes us well, and they’ve even kindly provided the soundtrack for that journey.